There is nothing moral about the way military veterans are treated by the VA – unless you are a government union boss. J. David Cox Sr., president of the American Federation of Government Employees, spoke at the June 16 “Moral Monday” political protest at the North Carolina state legislature. Cox loudly touted the benefits unions provide … to patients of the Veterans Administration. Apparently he doesn’t pay much attention to the news. (To see a short clip of his remarks, click below.)
Later Cox and his chief of staff, Bryan DeWyngaert, were arrested along with 18 others for trespassing after trying to disrupt the state Senate. They were arrested after warnings from General Assembly police to quiet down or leave the building. You might be surprised to hear Cox and DeWyngaert were devoting so much time shouting at a political protest rather than trying to remedy the VA’s disgraceful lack of care for so many men and women who have served our country.
To hear Cox’s full remarks, see video below.
Thank you for posting J. David Cox Sr., president of the American Federation of Government Employees full remarks. Unions and everyone voting for their own families economic interest is the only way justice will come to NC wage earning citizens.
Lonnie , your an idiot and a mouth breathing troll. The VA is a horrible medical system rife with corruption and poor medical care. It needs to be overhauled and unions leaders like Mr. Cox should be taken out and have his ass kicked for mouthing off like that.
As a veteran the system sucks and a government mooch like yourself will never understand that.
To even start to compare the US Military with the unions is just to stupid for words. The Military take an oath to protect and stay loyal to the Constitution. The unions work everyday to destroy the nation with their drive for a socialist economy and a Marxist dictatorship.
The only thing Unions have done for this country is send thousands of jobs overseas.Look at all the city’s and States that are big Union states like Ca. ILL.,Mich.They are all bankrupt,and have the highest taxes in the country.People and business are moving out in droves.Deadbeats and deadbeat lovers,like Lonnie will be all that’s left.
Lets see if I understand Mr Austin and Mr Mcduffie. People like myself who believe unions are the best path to economic justice for wage earning NC workers are un American? To go one step further conservatives are opposed to justice in America if it interferes with profit? Humanity, compassion and justice are the making of socialism and you conservatives want to eliminate all forms of socialism including public schools, fire department, Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, public libraries and expand for profit prisons, for profit security police, for profit schools? People who are not property owners should not be allowed to vote in your new American Plutocracy. Slave had jobs the American worker needs a living wage and union representation.
Lonnie,I am sick of your idea of justice.You think it was just fine to take over 50% of my pay to give the IRS a bonus.Many of these people have not paid their taxes for years.You wouldn’t know this because the communist press you watch won’t report it.Your idea is to pay lazy addicts anything they need so they will keep voting for Democrats.
Mr Mcduffie
I try to be polite and debate public policy with you based of facts. Now you making a comment like the one above is not even close to factual.
“You think it was just fine to take over 50% of my pay to give the IRS a bonus” Really? You can do both better math and better reasoning than this. Please show where such gross misinformation came from Civitas Institute doesn’t even put out information this outlandish. Then we have this jewell ” Many of these people have not paid their taxes for years? Who are “these people”? Do you mean the people working two jobs at $7.25 per hour to try to support their families on less than half a living wage but still have to pay NC Sales tax, Gasoline tax, fees , Social Security, Medicare and personal property tax?
Lonnie,I will be glad to show you my tax forms.Are you really stupid enough to think that there is nobody taking advantage of the system.I can introduce you to people that brag about getting paid for not working.If u didn’t have tunnel vision you would know the IRS under Lois Lerner targeted conservative groups.She even apologized for this before she took the the fifth.But she will still go to prison.You wouldn’t know a fact if it hit u between the eyes.If u would read u would know the people I am talking about are IRS employes that haven’t paid their taxes and still got a bonus,not poor people.I will meet you anywhere u say and show u my tax forms,then we will see who can’t do math.The reason u think no one pays over 50% is because Democrats have told u that all your life and you are too lazy or dumb to check it out for yourself.
Larry, we all pay taxes that go to things we strongly disagree with, I personally think the military is too much of a sacred cow, I don’t believe the oil industry needs subsiding and I don’t defend IRS employees not paying their taxes but 100% of you taxes don’t to cover the IRS bonuses. Wages paid by greedy fast food and retailers like Walmart are less than half of whats required for a family to live on and for some people they are better off not working at all then working one of these low wage jobs. We should both be on the same side here, we need more citizens paying into the system and not taking from the system. Let multi-national super rich corporation pay wages the worker can support a family on and not require taxpayers to subsidize their worker because the corporate management is extremely greedy.
Looks to me like the idiots and mouth breathers feel right at home here!
So, a collection of wing-nuttery comments such as:
Idiot, mouth breathing troll, ass kicked, government mooch, destroy the nation, socialist economy, Marxist dictatorship, deadbeats, communist press, pay lazy addicts, really stupid.
Classy stuff.
Yo Yo,You say the mouth breathers and idiots are right at home here.I guess u are right because you are here.
Lonnie and Yoyo both voted twice for a community organizer that had never had a job or even run a Lemonade stand.Now you think we should take your ramblings as serious.This guy was vetted less than any candidate in history.The Supreme Court has finally ruled that the EPA and Obama can’t just pass a law without going through Congress.The Dictator is starting to crumble.
Hey Larry,
You must be the biggest idiot, and least intelligent person here, and that’s saying something. I bet you were one of the ignurt white trash that actually believed Sarah Palin was the best candidut ever! Talk about a candidate that wasn’t vetted. Ignurt white trash!
Yeah Yoyo ,I can tell how smart you are by your spelling.If I was as dumb as you I would not use my real name either.
Larry try to focus. Tell me why you and I should be subsidizing the labor force on multi-national corporations that have more revenue than many small countries? What keeps Walmart, Variety Wholesalers, Yum Foods, or McDonalds from paying employees a wage they can actually support a family on and pay federal income taxes? Unionize these slacker corporations and we as a society will all be enriched with less poverty and in social ills that come from that grinding poverty .
Appears Larry simply doesn’t get it when he’s being mocked. Dumb & Dumberer.
Lonnie you try to focus.The average income in U.S. Is 43,692.The average in Sweden is 39,132.The average in Norway is 42,324.The average in Finland is 38,160.The unemployment rate in Sweden is 8.1.Norway 3.5.Finland is 9.5.the two most unionized states are Ca.and Mich.Both have 7.5 unemployment.Detroit has 17.7.Just what are the unions doing for the people of these states?This country became the richest in the world with Capitalism as our system.Then the Democrats started paying people not to work,paying people that are not even a citizen.Can you focus on that Lonnie?I’am 100% sure you can’t .Now to Yoyo,I think he is a grade school kid,so I won’t answer his dribble.By the way,the European countries you love are smaller than our states.They don’t have millions of immigrants with no education that we do.
Larry, do you not understand the Nordic countries have free market economies? Do you also not understand the reforms to raw Capitalism allowing for a less cruel system brought about with labor reforms, ending the robber baron era in the early 1900 when just a few American families controlled more wealth than the entire American government, They even hired their own Pinkerton police force often used bust union organizing. The writings of Charles Dickens, and Steinbeck were about the cruelty and injustice of raw Capitalism. FDR reformed much of this injustice by creating Social Security and supporting Union labor movement, later Johnson added a bigger social safety net with Medicare. Things started going south literally under Reagan with union busting and jobs moving first to non union American southern states, then Mexico and then Asia. By the way many of your Capitalist moved American jobs to totalitarian Communist capitalism completely free of unions, worker safety, vacation time or environmental laws. The question is what kind of world do you want for your grand children? Do you want a government that works for the common good of society or one that works for corporate greed, with control in the hands of pure Capitalist, lacking justice, humanity, compassion or common sense?
Lonnie,Do you not understand everything FDR’s started is broke.Last year Soc.Security sent out more money than It took in.Lonnie,I think you are a good person,but the system you want just has never worked and never will.Medicare is more broke than Soc.Security.You can take every dime the rich have and it won’t run the government 6 months.I doubt you have ever worked for a union,but I have.It’s human nature when one person is working hard and another isn’t and they both make the same pay the hard worker gets mad or gets lazy also.The first form of government in this country was socialism.The plan was to farm and gather food and all would share.But just like now all wanted to eat but some didn’t want to work.
Larry, I would love to agree with you but then we would both be wrong. The reform of raw Capitalism has worked amazingly, Social Security has not only allowed the elderly to age with dignity, the economic engine of Social Security dollars in small town America goes to pay rent, utilities, groceries, and gifts for grand children all creating jobs. Nothing in American economic history has returned the dividends of the GI Bill. The cap need to be removed on Social Security and Medicare should be expanded to include all Americans.We do need to tax the rich more but only to get them to pay employees more, then the fairly paid employees can also pay federal taxes. Unions are likely the only answer for real economic justice in America. You’re correct I never worked for a union but I always knew unions were the reason I received a raise of an additional holiday, another weeks vacation or health benefit. I worked for IBM when they paid employees fairly equal or slightly above union scale. I went to work for IBM at the age of 18 when unions were strong. The slacker corporations like Walmart, Variety Wholesalers, Yum foods, or McDonalds are worst than any poor person on welfare. They steal wages from the poor and don’t pay their share of taxes for services received for government agencies.
Lonnie,IBM’s profit margin is twice what Walmarts is.They could afford to pay you a whole lot more than Walmart could.Social Security is a Ponzi scheme.I paid in $121170.According to Soc.Security my employer paid in another $121403.Well,guess who that employer was?Me,Lonnie.I get 2168 a month until Soc.Security goes broke.If I live another 7 years I will break even.If I had put that $242573 into IBM stock,how many millions would I have now?The average single male making 43,000 a year gets back 192,000 more than they paid in to Soc. Security.It seems to me,that anyone that knows basic math knows Soc.Security is not sustainable.Never in the history of this country have we had 50%of the people paying nothing into the Federal Gov.Back when I made 1.65 per hr. I paid a small fed.tax.Unions had nothing to do with what you got paid at IBM.Huge profits at IBM did.
Larry, are you trying to justify the low wages paid by Walmart, Yum and McDonalds? You really think paying employees wages half of what is required to buy life’s basic needs of food, clothing, shelter, transportation and health care is ethical? Lets unionize the cheap, free loading corporations and see what the value of labor is.
Lonnie,there has to be a reason people are voting not to be in a union.It is probably they don’t want their money going to the Mafia and then to get Democrats elected.I have asked you several times,what is a living wage.You can’t have one size fits all on wages.IBM would not have a problem,but other companies with a very thin profit can’t pay wages that companies in the computer industry do.That is why we have lost so many jobs.We can’t compete with China.Is your plan to unionize companies no matter how the workers vote.Retail companies will never be able to pay what IBM,Google,and Apple pay.The main reason for this is obscene profits these companies make. You Libs love to go after oil companies who make percentage wise a lot less than IT companies.I have never seen the left go after any of these companies,who make so much profit,they can make millionaires out of their employees.I guess it’s O.K.to stick it to your customers if you pay your employees a living wage.But,I don’t know what a living wage is,because you won’t tell me.
I find the logic of conservative morally disgusting, that a person should work full time of 40 or more hours a week and not have enough income to buy the very basic necessary to survive without relying on taxpayer funded subsides, while that same corporation has owners and CEOs wealthier than nations. In todays dollars a living wage is certainly not $7.25 it should be more like double that amount. NO corporation should to do business with any government agency or be publicly traded until they can show their employees are paid well enough to support a family modestly. Tax laws should be harsh on those individuals exploiting workers with low wages while personal compensation is that of extreme wealth.
Here’s a speech by Michael D Higgins on this subject of economic justice. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WwvMNkCruGw
Lonnie,You can’t pay a 16 year old kid 15 dollars an hour to flip burgers.If you ever get this passed,which will never happen,you will put thousands out of a job.You act like there are millions out there making min.wage.Only 1.1 per cent make min. Wage and most of them are kids.Robots are already taking a lot of jobs.If you got your way Robots will be taking a lot more jobs.
Lonnie,If you have minimum skills,minimum education,and provide minimum contribution to the workplace,why the heck should someone be forced to pay you more.This Is a quote from a Black gentleman who happens to be one of the smartest people in this country.”why is it greed to want to keep the money you earned,but not greed to want to take someone else’s money”Also,What is your fair share of what someone else has worked for?
Before I turned 18 I was paid the same as an adult because I was doing the work of an adult. You know you can’t defend what Walmart pays employees nor the $7.25 an hour of todays minimum wage and being morally acceptable.
Unionize and we’ll see what the value of labor really is. I know you will make arguments against unions, I will save you the time here they are in this link. https://www.facebook.com/wisaflcio/photos/a.301699270668.144618.139173095668/10152178680040669/?type=1&theater
Lonnie,you never answer a question.You just repeat the same thing over and over.Its like you think if you say it enough it will be right.If you pay kids 15 dollars an hr. With benefits you are talking 20 dollars an hr. Or 800 dollars a week.The poor eat at McDonalds,think they can afford 6 bucks for a burger?I do not know why you don’t understand why you can’t understand that inflation would be unbelievable if the cheapest workers made that much.
Larry if predatory Capitalist like Walmart or the Fast food industry stops exploiting workers by paying employees a living wage and they won’t be poor anymore. Not only that they will make enough to pay federal income tax, save money for a child’s education and purchase more consumer goods. Conservatives whining amazes me, conservatives support public policy that allows American workers to be exploited to slave wages then complain when the workers don’t pay more in federal income taxes. Where’s the moral compass for such greed and injustice?
Larry, Lets use your math, not that I agree with the doubling wages of the fast food industry would result in the doubling of a burger but lets say it did. The work would pay say $5.00 more for lunch but earn $56.00 more per day. Let all workers in America making less than $10.00 per hour go on strike for a week and we would see the real value of their labor.
Lonnie,Are they not going to eat more than lunch?Being in business for over 40 years I can remember when the teamsters got wage increases constantly.Every time they got a raise the truck line would raise my prices.Then me and my customers would raise their prices.This is how out of control inflation gets started.You should have stayed awake in economics 101.If all those High School kids went on strike,they would be replaced with Latinos that you Democrats want coming here to be instant Democrats.These illegals and their working for lower wages is the main reason for lower wages.
Larry, many of those working in the fast food industry today are Latinos with families to support and they too deserve living wages not slave wages. Why should your cheap burger require a family to live in grinding poverty? Is that the best a free market Capitalist economy can do for workers?
Lonnie,it would be nice if we could take care of the whole world,but we can’t.We have spent trillions on poverty and there are more than ever.I know your answer by now ,just make companies pay more.Why can you not understand,we are in a global economy.If you can’t compete you go out of business.Thousands of businesses have gone out of business.Do you honestly think that increasing their payroll will make them compete better.I already know what you are going to say,so save the wear on your fingers.The bottom line is you can’t complete with greatly higher wages than your competition .
Larry, Walmart, Yum food are some of the world’s richest corporations, There is no need for a business model that lets its worker live in grinding poverty with taxpayers subsidizing their survival while the owner and CEO live in extreme luxury. Let’s unionize these slacker corporations that deserve being unionized. Corporations that don’t take care of their employees don’t deserve to be in businesses and should receive no support for local, state of federal government agencies nor American customers.
Lonnie,just heard 800,000 more people dropped out of the work force.That makes 93 million people out of work.That is the highest since,guess who,Jimmy Carter.You would think people that think like you would look at that and say,maybe this Socialism doesn’t work.I’am not holding my breath.
Larry, what we liberals are saying and have been saying is trickle down economic don’t work. Stop giving tax breaks to the undeserving rich, raise taxes on the wealthy, and create union scale jobs rebuilding America’s infrastructure. Recreate a strong middle class America with unions.
Lonnie,Does the pay the union leaders make not bother you.You can wish all you want to but unions are dead in the private sector.They will be dead in government also when people wake up to the corruption in the IRS,EPA,and just about any government agency you won’t to name.
Lonnie,England used to be the most powerful and richest nation on earth.Then the liberals took over and made them a second rate country just like they are doing to America.China moved to more of a capitalist system and you see what happened.What more proof do you need?
Larry, tell me again how a minimum of $7.25 per hour, while the CEOs makes millions per year while taxpayers make up the difference for the worker and his or her family to have life’s basic needs of food, clothing, shelter, transportations and health care is a good business model Americans should be proud of and willing to serve in our military to defend? How much different is this from slavery as a business model? The slave owners at least had a vested interest in the health of the workers?
Lonnie,if you could pass a law where Walmart has to pay 15.00 per hr. That would be one thing,but you would have to put that same law on Mom and Pop stores also.If you think these small stores can afford that you are crazy.Many thousands of small business have closed.Doubling the Min. Wage would close almost all of them.Thousands of these small business are barely hanging on now.
Larry, nothing has put Mom and Pop businesses out of business like the Walmart and fast food industry business models of low pay, cheap products made in Asia, and factory produced low quality food ingredients. Public policy should push to give Mom and Pop business a fighting chance. Legislate that any business that does business with a government agency must pay a living wage or be unionized. Legislate that no corporation can be publicly traded until Corporation pays its employees enough for the workers to meet life’s basic needs of food, clothing, shelter, transportation and health care without taxpayers assistance.
Lonnie,Once again you dodge my question,do you think Mom and Pop stores can afford double the min. wage.You read the New York Times hit piece on Walmart,but I bet my last dollar you didn’t read Walmart’s answer.That’s what I love about you liberals,don’t look at any facts just look at what the liberal press says.The press leans so for left today,the FCC should take their license to broadcast.Walmart hired 42,000 veterans this year.They donated over 1 Billion to charity.Also they are going to buy 250 Billion in the next 10 years of American made products,Apple just announced they would be adding 50,000 jobs to make their IPhones in China.Why aren’t you on their case?
Larry, to address your question Mom and Pops may not be able to afford the higher living wage but they can afford the $10.25 minimum wage. That was the point of my earlier post, give the Mom & Pops a little advantage over the multi nations who get all sorts of government subsidies not only the government but discounts from utilities and insurance. Walmart adding to an underpaid labor force is no feather in their cap when taxpayers will have to cover much of the support of the Walmart employee’s family. Here’s a follow up on that New York Times article, seems Walmart failed to use actual facts is discrediting the article. I want to keep this debate on the merits of a public policy of underpaying workers a decent American business model. I will engage you on the issue of liberal press, keep in mind all major American media is owned by multinational corporations, strong on Capitalism, most are defense contractors and the number of actual owners is less then six corporations. I have little political voice in America and none in China Why would you try to justify economic injustice in America with economic injustice in China?
Sorry Larry I forgot to add the link to the New York Times followup. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/06/24/walmart-fact-check-new-york-times_n_5525588.html
Lonnie,Is your idea of heaven is that we all make the same pay and wear black pajamas.What is the injustice in China?They have gone from being the poorest nation to soon having a bigger economy than ours.Your idea is laughable that the major press is not Liberal.Two of the major networks CEO’s have family members in the White House.The New York Times has not written a word about Bengazi or the IRS scandals.Most everyone except you and Libs know that they don’t print anything bad about Democrats.If you find anything they have written that makes a Democrat look bad I will pay you 100 dollars for it.The only reason they are still in business is Carlos Slim,a Mexican Billionaire who saved them from Bankruptcy.Msnbc is strong on Capitalism. Is the biggest joke I have ever heard.The CEO of GE,who did own MSNBC was one of Odumbo’s Czars’s.This is a conservative web site so I know that most people who read this are laughing their heads off that NY Times or the major networks are not extensions of the Democrat Party.
Lonnie,10.25 per hr.for the Mom and Pops won’t work,because you said 14.50 per hr.was a living wage.
So you would be okay if you or one of your children working their asses off and trying to survive on $7.25 per hour so the owners can living as multi millionaires? The liberal plan is not perfect so American workers must continue under the conservative plan of slave wages.
Lonnie,no system is perfect but Capitalism has done more to get more people ahead than any other.I worked my ass off for a whole lot less than $7.25 per hr.I was a kid just like most of the people on min.wage now.I kept looking for better jobs and moved on,as I got more experienceI got better jobs.It never dawned on me I could have gotten a pan to beat on to force my employer to pay me more.Of course,back in those days there was a work ethic and 51% of the people didn’t think 49% should take care of them like they do now?I was in grinding poverty as you put it,but not once did I take a penny from the gov.There is no pride in the country now.I have a small business that is a corporation.The corporate tax rate in this country is the highest in the world.If I didn’t have all the taxes to pay I could pay my employees a lot more.Believe me I would rather give my money to my employees than the Democrats who give it to people who wouldn’t work in a pie factory.
Larry you never answered this question nor did any of Art Pope’s employees.
Why is a minimum wage of $7.25 per hour for workers, and the CEOs makes millions per year while taxpayers make up the difference for the worker and his or her family to have life’s basic needs of food, clothing, shelter, transportations and health care is a good business model Americans should be proud of and willing to serve in our military to defend? This is not Capitalism its feudalism.
Lonnie,I did answer the question,you just chose to not read it,or it’s going over your head.I’am sure Walmart is just like me.They would rather give the money to their employees rather than the gov. To be thrown down a rat hole.Walmart is just like me,they don’t have a choice.They have to pay the highest corporate taxes in the world.Go on the web and you can find how much taxes they pay.Odumbo,just announced he is giving the moderate Muslims 500 million dollars in Syria.That alone takes a big chunk of what Walmart pays.Moderate Muslims indeed.What a joke.
Larry, When did Middle East foreign policy or the Islamic religion become part of this debate on humanity, justice, compassion, unions and a living wage?
I don’t recall seeing your answer, surly you wouldn’t mind restating your answer to the following questions.
Why is a minimum wage of $7.25 per hour for workers, and the CEOs makes millions per year while taxpayers make up the difference for the worker and his or her family to have life’s basic needs of food, clothing, shelter, transportations and health care is a good business model Americans should be proud of and willing to serve in our military to defend? Is this Capitalism or a return to feudalism?
Why do you expect tax payers to subsidize the pay role of extremely profitable multi National corporations like Walmart or Variety Wholesalers?
Lonnie,What part of the highest corporate taxes in the world do you not understand?I don’t know how to make it any simpler. If you pay it in taxes you don’t have as much left to give to your employees.How about we do away with corporate taxes and make corps.pay it to the employees.I know you won’t go along with this because what you really want is the biggest gov.possible.I bring up 500 million as just a small reminder of the almost 18 Trillion national debt.When this idiot you voted for came in to office it was 10.6 Trillion.Now send me a blog about Fuedalism.Rich CEO’s,Walmart,Art Pope,and on and on.I don’t even have to read them any more.Each one is like the last one.
Larry, you’re arguing the failed Trickle Down Economics lie which is nothing more than a redistribution of wealth from the working poor and middle class to the wealthy. Historical economic facts over the last 3-4 decade prove the failure of this lie. Besides we are not debating the public policy of taxes we’re debating the merits of a business model that requires taxpayers to subsidize the work force of American corporations like Walmart and Yum foods to keep the worker’s family from going hungry or freezing to death because after the employee works a 40 hour week they still don’t have enough income to meet basic needs of survival. Tell me how this is a business model Americans should be proud of and support?
I remind you again we’re not debating corporate tax policy we’re debating issues of fairness, justice, humanity, compassion and sensible business model that Americans can be proud.
This is to address the issue of corporate taxes you raised. “Amongst the 30 are corporate titans such as General Electric, Boeing, Verizon, and Mattel. The only four companies that slipped into positive tax territory were DTE Energy, Honeywell, Wells Fargo, and DuPont, with DuPont the only one that paid more than 4 percent over the four years.
Corporate taxes in the U.S., contrary to the constant protestations of conservatives, are at a 40 year low, with many of the most profitable companies paying nothing at all. ”
http://thinkprogress.org/economy/2012/04/09/460519/major-corporations-no-taxes-four-year/
Lonnie,You are hopeless.
No, Larry you and the conservatives here are attempting to defend public policy that has no merit, lacking common sense, justice, good economies and humanity. You cannot win on this when the public is informed.
Damn, I wish there was an edit button “economics”
Lonnie you need an edit button because you know zero about economics.When the public is informed,they will ship you off to Cuba.Look at the polls.Even college kids that have been listening to that crap of yours from their left over Hippie professors are turning againest Odumbo.His communist crap is not selling anymore.
Larry, we’re not debating President Obama, University students, hippies or failed Cuban foreign policy. By the Way the CIA developed an aging drug that appears to be working the Castro brothers look like very old men now.
How about answering the public policy questions you keep dodging?
We’re debating the merits of a business model that requires taxpayers to subsidize the work force of American corporations like Walmart and Yum foods to keep the worker’s family from going hungry or freezing to death because after the employee works a 40 hour week they still don’t have enough income to meet basic needs of survival. Tell me how this is a business model Americans should be proud of and support?
Lonnie,I will debate whatever I please.You must think you are Obama and can make all the rules.What you don’t have sense enough to see,is all this stuff effects each other.You don’t debate,you just put up some liberal site that has no proof in it.You have no idea if any of this crap is true.You want to believe it because most liberals are failures in life and need somebody to blame for it.If you really want to debate,tell me what was wrong with my idea of no Corporate tax but they have to give it to their employees.Tell me what is wrong with my idea.That would cure your whole argument but you won’t address it.You will just send me some article from some George Soros backed web site.Billionaire George Soros said he owned the Democrat party.He bought and paid for it.Now,if you really want to debate,tell me what is wrong with my idea.
Larry, We’re debating public policy, no need to throw personal insults of get angry, just stay on subject.
Trickle down economics is a lie, it does not work for anyone but the very rich at the expense of society, middle class citizens and the working poor suffer under voodoo economics.
You keep bring up George Soros so if you need to wiggle out of addressing the above ethics and morality questions of modern feudalism, I will give that a rest for a while. Let debate George Soros. What do you really know about his Open Society and the objectives of Government transparency, government accountability and journalism? http://www.opensocietyfoundations.org
What disturbs you the most about the Open Society Foundation? Did George Soros help end communism in former USSR satellite countries? What do you really know? Do you expect to win debates by just dropping words like “George Soros” “Liberal Media” “Odumbo”
” Socialism”?
Lonnie,What about my idea,You won’t answer it because it kills your whole stupid argument.Now,old George is a convicted felon in France.He was convicted of insider trading.His ideas are no country should have borders.You could go anywhere you please.Tell me you are not that stupid.If you really want to help people in grinding poverty,why won’t take my idea.It’s because you could care less about these people.It’s getting Communism in place that’s important to you.
Larry, from what I see or understand your e idea is just more failed trickle down economics.
I strongly disagree with the Koch Brothers extreme conservative public policy but I have to credit them with them charity support of some of the best hospitals in the world and unlike Art Pope I think they pay employees decent.
I support George Soros’s public policy but don’t really know that much about how he achieved his wealth. My question to you is what is your compliant with George Soros public policy and the Open Society foundation?
Lonnie,What does forcing employers to pay their employees more in exchange for less taxes have to do with Trickle down.Seems to me that what I propose would do exactly what you have been arguing for.I’am not surprised you don’t know much about George Soros.I’ve never known a Democrat in my life that would look at both sides before they make up their minds.They get there news from the left leaning sources and bad mouth Fox News,even though they have never watched Fox.If Walmart paid less taxes and paid more to employees would that not keep you from having to pay more taxes to keep their employees from grinding poverty.
Larry that’s what they do now, many corporations pay no federal tax. How can it be any less? Taxes are the least in history right now. http://www.cbsnews.com/news/high-taxes-actually-theyre-at-a-60-year-low/ The opposite is what historically has worked make taxes high and the employer had rather pay employees more, add employee benefits the employer also receives do company dinners or lunches rather then pay the government.
Lonnie,If taxes are at 60 year low it’s because half the people pay no federal taxes.Another reason is one third of the country,don’t have a job.Many corps.don’t pay any taxes,is just a lie.A very small fraction don’t because they had losses.If you make money you pay taxes,period.Now pay attention,since you must have ADD.I said about 10 times that employers would have to pay their employees more.That doesn’t seem to be that complicated.
Got news for you Larry and the other pro plutocracy Civitas Institute puppets. American corporations and the undeserving rich are going to have to pay employees more anyway, they will no longer get to free load on the sweat on the working poor and taxpaying middle class. Inequality or better put the new feudalism is not politically popular. The extreme right wing BS is not longer selling, you don’t have enough angry, old, fundamentalist, straight,rich, white men who are Rush Limbaugh fans to make a majority.
Lonnie,Wrong again.We kicked the commies out of Raleigh after 112 years.In Nov,we are going to make that wormy little Harry Reid the minority leader.People aren’t going to forget,”If you like your insurance,you can keep it.If you like your Doctor you can keep him.Deep down,Lonnie you know we are going to kick your butts.You have a problem with us old straight men.You aren’t a little light in the loafers are you,Lonnie?
Larry, I strongly disagree with you on politics, I think what the NC GOP is doing immoral and unjust but I don’t hate any of you. A large part of my family buys the crap you’re selling, I don’t hate them for not being better informed and voting against their own interest. Bigotry and scapegoating has always been a strong political tool. What liberals and progressives offer are ideas, possible solutions to real problems, clean air, clean water, rebuilding of out dated infrastructure, strong public education, science, clean energy, fair wages for a days work, justice, equality and liberty for all, not just straight, white, Christians males.
Lonnie,I don’t vote for my self interests.I vote for what I know works.France is a perfect example of why I hate Socialism.Unlike Obama,their President admits he is a socialist.They have a 35 hr. Work week .They also have a 10.4 unemployment rate and it hasn’t been under 8 per cent since the 1980’s.Obama says he wants us to be more like France.Well,he is doing a good job of that.All I know is,when companies are doing well the people have jobs and they do better than when they don’t have jobs.
Larry, your last statement is not even close to be true. The American worker and the middle class is in a nose dive with Republican trickle down economies favoring the undeserving rich.
https://www.google.com/search?q=decline+of+American+middle+class&hl=en&gl=us&authuser=0&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ei=mbiwU8bVK8iVyATc1YHgCA&ved=0CAgQ_AUoAw&biw=1429&bih=879#facrc=_&imgrc=FxJKK6oKeB2OLM%253A%3BP4Pm2SC-kV9puM%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fcdn.americanprogress.org%252Fwp-content%252Fuploads%252Fissues%252F2012%252F07%252Fimg%252Fmiddleclass_chart1.jpg%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Famericanprogress.org%252Fissues%252Feconomy%252Freport%252F2012%252F08%252F01%252F12034%252Fmaking-our-middle-class-stronger%252F%3B439%3B403
Larry the 10.4% unemployed in France live way above the 40% working poor in America. Slaves had jobs American workers need justice and a living wage.
Larry,
I can ask a MD friend of mine if he can recommend something for your condition, but alas, I think you are beyond help.
You have been exposed to far too much Fox Noise, when you use words like commie, Odumbo, socialism, Bengazi or IRS scandals, you sound like a uninformed, and very ignorant hick.
I read through your diatribe and counted just about every crazy talking point I’ve heard in the last few years. How is it possible to take a SINGLE thing you state here seriously?
Lonnie,Maybe your family can get through to you.The rest of the worlds poor can only dream about what our poor have.
Yo Yo,I guess since you don’t watch Fox you never heard of Bengazi.Glad you learned to spell ignorant,Commie boy.
“Commie boy”? That’s hilarious.
And you still have no idea you were being mocked? Seriously?
ignurt, ignurnt, ignorant? Which is it?
Yoyo,you tell me.You are the one that can’t spell it.Can you tell you are being mocked.
Larry is this you? https://www.facebook.com/ProgAmerica/photos/a.222160157992785.1073741828.220068878201913/246893642186103/?type=1&fref=nf
Lonnie, If you and Yoyo had a brain,you would take it out and play with it.
Larry or any of the good people at Civitas Institute lets keep this discussion on public policy not petty personal attacks.
Why should corporations that don’t take care of their employees, deserve to be in businesses or receive support of local, state of federal government agencies or the American consumer?
Why is a minimum wage of $7.25 per hour for workers, while the CEOs makes millions per year, leaving the taxpayers to make up the difference for the worker and his or her family to have life’s basic needs of food, clothing, shelter, transportations and health care a good business model? Why should Americans be proud of this unjust business model and willing to serve in the US military to defend it?
Lonnie,you do pretty good on personal attacks.I told you several times how to fix the problem.Your only answer is tax the corp.more.My idea you called trickle down.It sure does not trickle up.When you worked for IBM and they paid u was that not trickle down.You said u had been in business.Did you say one day I believe I’ll start a business so I can pay my employees 20 dollars an hour and If that’s not enough to meet their every need I will pay them more.I would say you probably thought,maybe I can start this business to pay my family’s bills.Tell the truth,you have never had an employee have you?I know u won’t answer this,it be some diatribe about Corp.,justice and on and on.Like I haven’t seen that 50 times.
Larry,
I see more personal attacks from you on this website than anybody else.
Larry, Tax cuts for the rich seem to be the limit of conservative thinking. Political leadership with visions is what our country needs, not small minded, I got mine you get yours, scapegoating with no real solutions to the problems of a fast changing world. Vision like that of JFK and putting a man on the moon just to prove we can do it. Look at the knowledge, jobs and advancement in mankind that we as a nation achieved because JFK had vision. Has this been the small minded conservatives they would have given a tax cut to the rich instead on the space program.
How do you justify the richest corporations and families in the world massing so much wealth from a rigged political system at the expense of their employees and American taxpayers. Low wage workers live in grinding poverty because of greedy CEOs and owners of the world’s richest corporations. How Do you and fellow conservatives sleep supporting such injustice?
Lonnie,you stepped into that one.Kennedy is the only Democrat that ever did a tax cut.What happened then,a boom in business,more people got jobs,and the Gov. collected more taxes.The same thing that happens every time there is a tax cut.You might be too young to remember but you can look it up.It won’t be on one of those left wing sites you seem to live on.YoYo was probably not born at the time.His mother was probably trying to decide to abort or not.
Classy stuff Larry, keep it up. The more hate & venom you spew the worse you make this organization look.
“Please proceed Governor”.
YoYo,What’s this all this hate stuff.I don’t hate you,I fell sorry for you.You and Lonnie are just a product of the education system in this country the last 40 years.The Russians back in the 60’s said they take us over by getting the teachers and the media to preach Communism.And now you and Lonnie are all for it.So it worked.I notice you or Lonnie don’t want to talk about Kennedy’s tax cut.Democrats always talk about him like he was God,until you mention the tax cut and then it’s the end of the conversation.Unless it’s you and you want to tell me how ignorant I am.Then I’am the hater.
Larry, This is 2014, the Russians aren’t coming to get you, nor is communism taking over the USA. Who said the Russians would take over us by “getting the teachers and the media to preach Communism” exactly? Do you have ANY idea how foolish you sound when you say things like that? On the subject of tax, do you want to talk about Reagans tax INCREASES, since Republicans always “talk about him like he was God”? I really, truly, fell sorry for you too.
Larry, let do this again, not sure where the first post went.
To your Kennedy comment.
“The top marginal tax rate was 91 percent, which JFK wanted reduced to a “more sensible” 65 percent. Compare that with today’s 35 percent top rate, and ask: If supply-siders are so enamored of JFK’s tax policies, would they advocate a return to a “more sensible” 65 percent top rate?”
http://www.usnews.com/opinion/articles/2011/01/26/the-myth-of-jfk-as-supply-side-tax-cutter
Larry, lets get back to the injustice of exploiting workers and the Walmart business model or scam. Why would you and fellow conservatives approve of this freeloading on the worker and the taxpayer’s dine?
http://www.jwj.org/walmarts-food-stamp-scam-explained-in-one-easy-chart
YoYo,His name was Khrushchev.Now don’t you feel foolish for not knowing that?I told you the education system had gone to pot.Compared to what we have now,Reagan was a God.Obama is knocking Jimmy Carter out of the top spot for worst president ever.
Lonnie,If you think 65 per cent tax is fair,take out that fat check book of yours and send a check for 65 per cent of what you make this year.Not such a good idea when it’s your money is it?Margaret Thatcher had it right.Socialism is great,until you run out of other peoples money.The share of the public debt now is 55,000 for every man woman,and child.That’s not enough for you Democrats,you want Gov. to spend more.
Oh Larry, can you give me some link or reference that actually supports this, or not?
You are one sad, angry, ignurnt, old man (note the spelling mistook). “Please continue Governor”.
Kudos for landing the Civitas attack dog job, I bet they pay you less than minimum wage to “guard” their website!
YoYo,Who is paying you?My guess is Welfare.
YoYo,I don’t know what you want a link on.If it is how much we each owe on the national debt,you can find it on Brillig.com
Larry reading your post tells me you’re way out of touch with reality or in what some call the conservative bubble in which no information can penetrate. You look for anything that will support your myths and there’re plenty of marketeer willing to tell you what you want to hear. Did you ever notice who is advertising on the right wing fear mongering programs? Gold or someone wanting to take advantage of the fear you just bought from snake oil salesman like Rush. Look at who the right is attacking liberals, teachers, unions, scientist, women, minorities, undocumented residents, LBGT Americans, the poor, environmentalist, university professionals, artist, musicians, public schools, students and medicaid recipients.
Lonnie,17 Trillion in debt and each one of your grand kids,if you have any,owe 55,000 each already.And I am the one that’s out of touch.It just struck me,you are just like Obama.You talk real pretty but you don’t really say anything.There is a famous youtube video of this woman with 15 kids telling all of us something has to be done to take care of her and kids.You need to look at this and tell me that I need to take care of morons like this,instead of my own kids
Larry, your conservatives have never seen a war or a defense project they didn’t want to fund. If you make $50,000 your share of the food stamps program is $0.10, that goes into your local economy.
Lonnie, you pull stats.out of thin air.Then you say my information on the debt is a myth.You get on these tangents about Rush and Gold and god knows what.That’s your way of avoiding the debt question,right?I won’t you to tell me that I’am wrong on the debt.I know you won’t do that because you want the biggest government ,borrowing from China will buy.
Larry if you want to fix the debt raise taxes on those who benefit most from our free market system, use our infrastructure, most, use the courts most, use our ports most, benefit most from police protection, use roads most then unionizes all American labor raising wages so all American worker make enough income to pay federal income tax. Stop the unnecessary wars, legalize most drugs and treat drug addiction as a medical problem. Free most of the two million non violent Americans behind bars and close all for profit prisons. Rebuild the decaying American infrastructure, rebuild American cities, build high speed rail network across America, build dependable light rail in every medium to large city in American, build parks and bike trails or greenways. Conservatives have no vision, no ideas and no solutions. Tax cuts for the rich is the limit of conservative vision.
Larry, you’re correct I should have given you my source on information on my comments above. I try to always backup my comments. Here is a link to that source backing up the following comment.
Conservatives have never seen a war or a defense project they didn’t want to fund. If you make $50,000 your share of the food stamps program is $0.10, that goes into your local economy.
http://www.examiner.com/article/a-person-making-50-000-a-year-pays-10-cents-a-day-taxes-for-food-stamps
Lonnie, Think.The debt Lonnie,the debt.Lonnie,you need to stay off those Commie web sites.Are you really dumb enough to believe all those millions are taken care of for 10 cents a day.I can go on the web and type all kinds of crap,that doesn’t make it true.You can’t make up your mind on what is right by only listening to one side.I’am a conservative by years of double checking both sides.I found out Democrats lie a lot more than conservatives.I guess I’am going to have to list all of Obamas lies,I hate to do it because it is a lot of typing.
Lonnie,I forget to ask,did you send in your check for 65 per cent of your pay.You probably need to send it all in ,to pay for all your wish list .If your wife works,you can send it in to help pay for the 110,000 dollars in national debt we owe for two people.You say I don’t prove what I say.Just search National debt.There are about 20 sites you can pick from,that show we owe over 17 Trillion.The Democrats haven’t figured a way to lie about that.So,they,the media,commie web sites just don’t mention it.
Larry, the debt is no big deal we always have money for war, prisons, and the sugar subsides.
Conservatives have no vision, no ideas and no understanding of justice.
Lonnie,the debt may not be a problem to you, but you have no justice for the coming generations.Oh. That’s right,you want to kill all of them in the womb.You Dems. Are so compassionate.Why don’t we just do away with prisons,turn the prisoners loose and see how that works out.Then we could turn over all those evil Corporations to Obama since he is doing so well with everything else.Then we can change our name to Cuba and Lonnie could live happily ever after with that 219 dollars a year that Castro pays.
Lonnie,you are right about the wars.Obama wants congress to o.k. 500 million to go to the Syrian rebels.I’am if they say no he will just do an executive decision and send it anyway.He says these rebels are moderate Muslims and have been vetted.I wonder who went over and asked them if they were the sweet Muslims.
Larry, you conservatives are a gloomy bunch. Just think the economy was very close to another great depression when President Obama took office and now this today.
https://www.google.com/search?hl=en&gl=us&tbm=nws&authuser=0&q=Dow+today&oq=Dow+today&gs_l=news-cc.3..43j43i53.1589.5885.0.6288.9.4.0.5.5.0.73.225.4.4.0…0.0…1ac.1.I2GpuO0J5is&gws_rd=ssl#authuser=0&gl=us&hl=en&q=Dow+today
Larry not sure my last link worked.
“The Dow Jones industrial average came within less than 2 points of hitting 17,000 for the first time ever before pulling back and closing up 129.47 points, or 0.8%, to a record high of 16,956.07.”
http://www.usatoday.com/story/money/markets/2014/07/01/stocks-tuesday/11890629/
Lonnie,93 million people out of work,I would call that a depression.And,what are you doing bragging about the stock market.Is that not for the Plutocrats?The reason the stocks are going up is there is no where else to invest your money.The Fed.has interest rates so low no one is putting their money in the banks.
“Lonnie,93 million people out of work”
I believe you numbers are nearly 10 times to high, You must watch Fox Propaganda.
” THE EMPLOYMENT SITUATION — MAY 2014
Total nonfarm payroll employment rose by 217,000 in May, and the unemployment rate was
unchanged at 6.3 percent, the U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics reported today. Employment
increased in professional and business services, health care and social assistance, food
services and drinking places, and transportation and warehousing.
Household Survey Data
The unemployment rate held at 6.3 percent in May, following a decline of 0.4 percentage
point in April. The number of unemployed persons was unchanged in May at 9.8 million.
Over the year, the unemployment rate and the number of unemployed persons declined by
1.2 percentage points and 1.9 million, respectively. (See table A-1.)
Among the major worker groups, the unemployment rates for adult men (5.9 percent),
adult women (5.7 percent), teenagers (19.2 percent), whites (5.4 percent), blacks
(11.5 percent), and Hispanics (7.7 percent) showed little or no change in May. The
jobless rate for Asians was 5.3 percent (not seasonally adjusted), little changed
from a year earlier. (See tables A-1, A-2, and A-3.)”
http://www.bls.gov/news.release/empsit.nr0.htm
Larry, this is to you concerns over the deficit under President Obama. Keep in mind those first few years are a reflection on the Bush Admin. not Obama.
http://www.politico.com/story/2014/02/budget-deficit-shrinks-103092.html
Larry neither you nor any of the Civitas Institute folks addressed this question. Why?
Why would you and fellow conservatives approve of the Walmart business plan of freeloading on underpaying employees and letting the taxpayer’s dime make up the difference between the wages paid employees and what’s required to support a family’s basic needs in life?
Walmart and similar moocher corporations should be unionized to stop this redistribution of wealth to the top.
http://www.jwj.org/walmarts-food-stamp-scam-explained-in-one-easy-chart
Lonnie,The unemployment rate has nothing to do with how many people have dropped out of the work force.Search for how many people have dropped out.You will find dozens of sites,even lots of liberal ones.They all show that people in the labor force have dropped to 62 per cent,the lowest since 1977.This was when the last commie loser,Carter was in office.Now if you weren’t on the Commie web sites,you would know this.Since you don’t look at both sides,you are really that clueless,or you chose to ignore any news that makes Democrats look bad.
Larry, Are you really calling all of the liberals, progressives, Democrats and moderate Republicans Communist?
Lonnie,why no comment about the woman with 15 kids.She says somebody needs to take care of her and her kids.There are millions of people like this all over the country.This is more of a problem than people at Walmart making almost 13 dollars an hr.Which one is more of a problem,one with a job,that is not getting rich or one that expects everything from Gov.I know you won’t say anything about people that lay around and make babies for a living.Because you would not speak bad about another Democrat.
Lonnie,when did I call a moderate Republican aCommie?I know you want drugs legal.Are you on crack?
Larry, so now you want to change the subject and comment on right wing myths, half truths and scapegoats? What is this woman’s name and where does she live with 15 children? Do you want those 15 children to starve, go without healthcare, education and a warm place to sleep? Do you want the children grow up to be dependent on taxpayers for support or do want to solve the problem or at least try? Like I keep saying conservatives have no solutions, no vision, no ideas and no humanity.
Larry, just trying to understand the depth of conservative crazy. You are calling all Liberals, Progressives, and Democrats communist but not moderate Republicans is that correct?
Lonnie,That web site link says Walmarts average pay is 8.81 per hr.That is a total lie.The average pay is 12.81 per hr.I told you those Commie sites spin the truth.I know you are going to send me another one.
Larry, Walmart is a poverty creator not a job creator. The average Walmart wage is $8.81 per hour.
“Fact: Walmart jobs are poverty jobs.
Walmart workers average just $8.81 hour. This translates to annual pay of $15,576, based on Walmart’s definition of full-time. This is less than two-thirds of the poverty line for a family of four, and well below what most families actually need to get by.”
http://walmart1percent.org/issues/top-reasons-the-walton-family-and-walmart-are-not-job-creators/
Lonnie,That 8.81 is a lie and I don’t care how many lying websites you send.You say do I want to solve the problem of the woman with 15 kids.Exactly how would I do that.If you think she is a myth,search woman with 15 kids says we owe her money.I know you want do it because it’s on youtube coming right out of her mouth,not some stupid website that can print any pile of crap they please.You can’t handle the truth.Who is a moderate Republican.Can you show me one that believes that crap you do?All my life I have questioned everything.You seem to believe anything these web sites say without question.
Lonnie,I did a search on the company that says Walmart is 8.81.It’s a company called IBIS.It is an Australian company,run by surprise,an ultra liberal whose big deal is trying to raise taxes.His name is Phil Ruthven and I am sure he is unbiased.Do you think Walmart gave him their payroll records so he could look them over.I don’t think so.I told you these web sites lie,and so do some Republicans web sites.You have to check them out to see who is lying.
Larry, is Forbes on of those commie rags?
“Walmart’s low-wage workers cost U.S. taxpayers an estimated $6.2 billion in public assistance including food stamps, Medicaid and subsidized housing, according to a report published to coincide with Tax Day, April 15.”
http://www.forbes.com/sites/clareoconnor/2014/04/15/report-walmart-workers-cost-taxpayers-6-2-billion-in-public-assistance/
Lonnie,pay attention,I never said some of Walmart employees don’t collect welfare.Obama has half the population on it now.What I’am saying it’s not a drop in the bucket to what it’s costing us for these welfare Queens and all their kids.You didn’t look at the youtube of that woman,did you?The wisdom of Democrats is this.Have all the kids you want and we will pay for them unless you have a husband or boyfriend around.Black families used to be very stable until the Do Gooder Democrats made the Black population mostly a one parent situation.
Lonnie,That Forbes web site was pretty cute of you.It was a copy of a study by Americans for tax fairness.They are a collection of 400 progressive groups.Which is the new name Liberals like to call themselves since most people didn’t like what the Liberals had to say.After Obama is done,the people will know what progressives are.
Larry,
“Lonnie,pay attention,I never said some of Walmart employees don’t collect welfare.Obama has half the population on it now.”
Really? I thought it was the trickle Down Economic and cheap billionaire not paying their employees fairly as you seem to agree in this comment.
“I never said some of Walmart employees don’t collect welfare.”
How would you as a non “Do Gooders” deal the 15 children you want to make the face of all low wage working Americans? Would you let them go hungry, without education, clothing or shelter?
Lonnie,I would let people like you pay for their15 kids,since your party’s vote buying incentives are what caused the problem in the first place.Vote for Democrats,we will steal other peoples money and give it to you.Great news!!!!Todays Quinnipiac poll says Obama has now passed Jimmy Carter as all time worst President.You and YoYo and a handful of die hard commies are the only ones that didn’t get the message.
Larry, your last post just proves my point, conservatives have no real solutions to real problems. You and fellow conservatives are little more than cartoon characters running around on a medicare scooters yelling “Commie” “Benghazi” “Obummer” “Odumber” socialist, “Kenyan” “Muslim”
This is the current GOP base.
https://www.facebook.com/ProgAmerica/photos/a.222160157992785.1073741828.220068878201913/246893642186103/?type=1&fref=nf
Lonnie,Did I hit a nerve there.Got a little testy when you found out your Muslim,Odummer,Obummer,Socialist,Kenyan, was picked as the worst ever.When do you ever sleep.You must stay up all night looking for those joke web sites that you use to prove your point.Only problem is,it’s so easy to tear them apart,like the one from Forbes.
Lonnie Webster: “…everyone voting for their own families [sic] economic interest…”
Appears to me that many union members, given the opportunity, are voting with their feet.
Lonnie Webster: “…conservatives are opposed to justice in America…”
Ha Ha! I don’t believe ‘justice’ means what you think it means.
Hint: Many of us don’t believe it is ‘justice’ to forcibly steal money, under threat of incarceration, from someone who has earned it and redistribute it to someone who has not earned it, just because YOU believe they deserve it.
But good job knocking down all those straw men, as usual.
Larry, sorry I seemed a little testy, I just got frustrated trying to communicate with a person without the ability to see the full scale of the problem here.
What is your solution beyond me personally paying the bills for the 15 children? How many fathers do the children have ? Home many of the fathers are in prison? How many of the fathers are disabled? What is the education of the mother? Does the mother believe abortion is murder as many conservatives do? Did the mother have easy access birth control and sex education before her first pregnancy? What attempts of breaking the cycle of poverty would you conservatives make? Does the woman have an opportunity for a living wage job? Does this mother have any mental health issues? Did the mother come from a similar home environment? Is the mother in or need treatment for addiction? What ideas, or solutions do you see?
A. Conservative
How does someone earn over a million dollars per year, paying workers half the cost life’s basic necessities? They are the undeserving rich. Did those rich Walton’s and Popes build their own highways, ports, and inter coastal water ways?
Lonnie,You didn’t watch the video,or you would know she is not capable of working anywhere.She probably comes from a mother and a grandmother that lived the same way.If you give people incentives to do nothing,they will do nothing.Its too late to do anything with her,she is just a baby factory.With her 15 kids,you Liberals would have to give her 150,000 a year to be a living wage.You tell me what the answer is?You can take all the money that Art Pope,and people like him,have and it won’t be enough to take care of all the people like her.My mother grew up with 7 siblings.She had to barter eggs with a store keeper to get pencil and paper to go to school.She and her brothers and sisters never got rich but all got to middle class without help from the Gov.What’s changed?The Democrats saw that they could talk about the rich and some how make people think that they were poor because of the rich.Then every election it was something we will give you if you vote for us.Trillions later there are more of these people than ever.After they found out the Gov. Would feed and clothe them they just stay home and make babies.My mother and her family might have turned out the same way,but there were no vote buying programs back then.Obama is letting thousands come over the border.Why is he doing this?Because he will put them on every program there is,and they will be instant Democrats.If this is not right,you tell me why he is letting all this people come in.What other reason could there be.A country that control it’s borders,is not a country.
Larry, What’s your solution for the 15 children beyond me personally paying the bills or blaming liberals and Obama?
Are you going to let them starve? Freeze? Deny them an education? Split the family up? What positive solutions do you have? Have you traveled to the southern border and seen what it looks like for hundreds of miles of empty space? Do you have a solution for the thousands of underage children coming now?
Larry
“My mother grew up with 7 siblings.She had to barter eggs with a store keeper to get pencil and paper to go to school.She and her brothers and sisters never got rich but all got to middle class without help from the Gov.” I’ll bet if we dig just a little we will find that simply isn’t true. This would have been during the years of FDR and few American missed being helped by the New Deal. Did the government provide schools for an education, Was there a WPA project in the community? Did the community have a Library or book mobile? How about postal service and the jobs that came with it? REA, when did their community get electricity? Jobs from the defense during world War II and after? If your family is black ending the Jim Crow era was a huge benefit.
Lonnie,My mother told me she never knew when the Depression started or when it ended.They were dirt poor before and after.Now you might think she was lying,but I have no reason to believe she lied to me.If you knew anything about History you would know nothing got much better after FDR until after WW2.I think there were schools before FDR.As far as I know there was no WPA in Sylva.Library,you must be joking.Most people in Sylva had outhouses until the 60’s.No defense jobs in Sylva.
Lonnie,I know you find it hard to believe,but there are some people that have made a life without Democrats hand outs.My Mother was the type that would have starved before she took any charity from anybody.I frankly don’t give a darn whether you believe that or not.There used to be a lot of people like that before the welfare state took over.Now most people think the Gov.owes them a living.
Did your mother receive Social Security, Medicare and if she had to go in nursing home at the end, medicaid was likely needed.
Here what the New Deal did for NC, conservatives then like today fought to keep those in need from benefiting from federal program designed to give them assistance.
http://www.northcarolinahistory.org/commentary/31/entry
Larry, Don’t forget to address this.
What’s your solution for the 15 children beyond me personally paying the bills or blaming liberals and Obama?
Are you going to let them starve? Freeze? Deny them an education? Split the family up? What positive solutions do you have? Have you traveled to the southern border and seen what it looks like for hundreds of miles of empty space? Do you have a solution for the thousands of underage children coming now?
Lonnie,nice try but my mom died at 61 with ALS.Never got medicare,never got Soc.Security,never went into a nursing home.You just can’t believe someone could live and die without leaching off everybody else can you?As for what to do with that woman with 15 kids,I would get a list of everybody that voted for Obama and send them one of the kids that are walking across the border.I would say,you want all these people here,so you can adopt them and the same with the idiot with 15 kids.You need to put your money where you mouth is.If you Democrats were not paying this woman to have more and more kids,they would not have so many Every time she has one you raise her welfare pay.This is happening all over the world and I would like to be able to help every one of them.Its just not possible to help everybody in the world.Now you keep asking what I would do.There you have it.I guess you would tax Walmart more,but if you took every dime from Walmart you could not take care of all this people.You call Republicans greedy for not wanting to pay for all these people.Democrats are the ones that are greedy because they make these people so dependent they can never make it on their own.Do Democrats give a darn about these people?Some do,but the Hillary’s,Pelosi’s,Harry Reid’s,Jessie Jackson’s,and many other millionaire race baiters could care less about these people.Its their votes and that’s all.
Larry, your last post reinforces my opinion that conservatives have no solutions to real problems. The extremism consuming the Republican Party today are very short sighted and have no vision for tomorrow.
Let me share my personal Liberal vision on the 15 children, you think society should turn their back on.
We agree the mother will never win mother of the year award.
Breaking the cycle of this kind addiction, poverty and ignorance should be the goal. Treatment and training opportunities for the mother, living wage jobs and affordable child care and affordable mental health treatment. Society may be better served if the father was in a mandatory drug treatment program and skills training program rather then prison. The publicly funded child care would expose the children to mentors and positive role models.America needs a strong world class public education system with more opportunity for positive role models and after school youth programs for additional opportunities for positive role models. Today we are spending a very high percentage of our national resources on the symptoms of a failed society with complex causes. These are the symptoms of a failed society high drug use, greed at both end of the economic scale, crime both on Wall Street and back streets, very high prison population, corruption, police brutality, high percentage of population in grinding poverty, gangs, homelessness and super rich living in fortresses of gated communities with private security. To your point that humanity, compassion and justice breeds dependency, why are these problems so much less in Canada?
Lonnie,Where have you been the last many years.All this stuff you mention has been tried by the Democrats.Costing us Trillions.Will you ever learn this crap has not and will not work.We have more of these people than ever.We are broke Lonnie. A blind person should be able to see that.As for Canada,maybe only having around 4% of their population minorities has something to do with it?Now,knowing how you Libs.think,I know what is next.Raciest!!! The problem you have with that is you can’t argue stats.Also you don’t know if I’am Black,Latino,or white.
Larry, lets see some stats and facts? We’re not requiring major super wealthy corporations to pay a living wage nor their share of taxes. The super wealthy pay a smaller percentage of income in taxes than a middle class professional, sometimes half that of a middle class professional. Unions in America have been all but destroyed leaving wage earning workers at the mercy of greedy CEOs. Here’re some facts that disprove your myths, I hope can penetrate the conservative bubble .
http://charlotte.cbslocal.com/2013/07/02/poverty-in-america-myths-about-welfare-recipients/
Larry and Civitas Institute employees
When small minded, lazy politicians make public policy decisions based on bumper sticker definitions of problems. When politicians with broken moral compasses believe myths supplied by special interest groups, we get the failure of public policy we see today. We see groups like Civitas Institute sow the seeds of bigotry, fear, hate and scapegoating, appealing to the worst of humanity. Hate mongers fill the airways of AM Talk Radio, Fox News delivers a steady stream of misinformation also reinforcing stereotypes and myths easily disproven if only one looks for facts.
Lonnie,I have never heard of anybody having a gun held to their head and making them work at Walmart or anywhere else.You can go somewhere else to get a job.Well,you used to be able to before the morons took over and closed a large amount of businesses.
Larry, Do you have any actual facts to support your last comment?
Walmart, Yum food are some of the world’s richest corporations, There is no need for a business model that lets its worker live in grinding poverty with taxpayers subsidizing their survival while the owner and CEO live in extreme luxury.
Here’s a speech by Michael D Higgins on this subject of economic justice, I suggest you listen closely. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WwvMNkCruGw
Lonnie,why do you keep on sending the web sites to prove your points.I dare say 99% of people on this site don’t believe a word CBS,ABC,NBC,CNN,Dailey Kos,or any of that Liberal crap.If you are trying to win people over to your side don’t send them something that is so easily proven to be Liberal spin.All the bumper stickers I see are some commie crap holding a Subaru together.Quit lying Lonnie,You have never been on Fox News in your life.
Lonnie,You want proof that those morons have closed down a lot of business.Climb on your solar powered bicycle and take a drive through Boone.I’am sure Boone is no different than ever town I have been to in the last 5 years.Closed down Malls,shuttered stores,closed plants every where you go.
Larry, Thank You, You have been an excellent voice for right wing extremism.
Lonnie,What part of what I said is extreme?
Larry, glad you ask because misinformed voters and public policy makers make poor public policy decisions.
The comment is true, its what’s called by more reasonable citizens as the conservative bubble, no information can penetrate the conservative bubble even from your own advisors. You have represented that generic conservative perfectly in our discussions without getting too rude too often.
Extreme but true comment below.
“I dare say 99% of people on this site don’t believe a word CBS,ABC,NBC,CNN,Dailey Kos,or any of that Liberal crap.”
Lonnie,If that’s the best you can do on me being extreme,that’s pretty lame.
Larry, Was I supposed to be more insulting?
How informed can you be if you eliminate information that fails to conform to your myths and bigotry?
Lonnie,You are the king of changing the subject when I nail you with the facts.
Larry,
I don’t recall you providing any facts, only opinions.
We can bring the debate back around if that’s what you want.
Reforming raw Capitalism has worked amazingly, Social Security has not only allowed the elderly to age with dignity, the economic engine of Social Security dollars in small town America goes to pay rent, utilities, groceries, and gifts for grand children all creating jobs. Nothing in American economic history has returned the dividends of the GI Bill. The cap needs to be removed on Social Security and Medicare should be expanded to include all Americans. We do need to tax the rich more but only to get them to pay employees more, then the fairly paid employees can also pay federal taxes. No corporation should be allowed to go public until they pay workers a living wage. Unions are the only answer for real economic justice in America giving workers a seat at the table of American free market prosperity and a political voice.
Lonnie,How does anybody get stupid enough to think you can pay more than your profit margin allows.Sure,Walmart makes a lot of profit,but they also have over 2 million employees.I would bet my last dollar that all the tax increases you propose do not apply to you.If that is true,then you are part of the take care of me crowd.You already told me I was stupid for working too hard in my business.I think people that read our back and forth can tell who believes in hard work and taking care of their self and who believes in living off the hard working people.Soc.Security is broke and young people know they are not going to get anything out of it.If they ever figure out who gave us that Ponzi scheme,Democrats will be History.
Larry,
If the Walmart and fast food industry business models depend on taxpayer supplementing their labor force then they should not be in business giving small main street stores and shops an opportunity to compete once again with more private business owners.
To recap your last post extreme Republicans are now opposed to Social Security, medicare, GI Bill, rebuilding American infrastructure, paying fair wages, Pell Grants for higher education and a social safety net? I assume a bloated military budget, war and unlimited prisons are still acceptable expenses to the GOP.
Lonnie,I have no idea what that first paragraph means.The last part is the same old song that you have posted at least 50 times.
Larry,
I’m not sure anyone but us read the posts but they do show the contrast between Conservative and Liberal thinking.
Liberals believe the American worker should represented by organized labor and unions should bargain for living wages, worker benefits, safe working conditions.
Liberals believe all workers should be paid a wage the worker can afford to pay federal income tax and not have to rely on food stamps or tax credit to support their families.
Liberals believe government should represent flesh and blood citizens not corporate profits at any cost to society.
Liberals believe in personal freedom and liberty for all.
Liberals believe in education, knowledge and find solutions to real problems, making the world better not worst.
Above all Liberals believe in justice.
Lonnie,
I can’t understand why you aren’t happy.Obama said he would change America.Thats one thing he didn’t lie about.He is a bigger communist than any president.He has changed this country like never before.So,why do you still need to whine.
Larry,
You’re into personal attacks again, lets keep the debate on issues of public policy.
Larry,
Is it your belief and that of Civitas Institute that free market economies cannot be compatible with justice, humanity and compassion?
Social safety nets that include universal health care, labor unions, public education, social security and public infrastructure are to be labeled communism? Tell me again how you and Civitas Institute are not an extremist organization.
Lonnie.
To me,someone who spends many times their income is the extremist.Someone,who wants the borders wide open for people that have diseases,drugs,and terrorists,is the extremist.To you,someone that lives within their means,is a terrorist.I’am comfortable with which one is the extremist or the terrorist.
Larry,
Could you do a budget for a young family trying to live on $290.00 per week without public assistance?
Larry,
How is an 8 year old child crossing the southern border to escape a failed society, a threat to the United States of America?
What answers do you have for the humanitarian crisis of un accompanied children on the southern border?
Lonnie,
One wouldn’t be,millions will be.Why would would they come here anyway?According to you they can’t make a living wage.
Larry,
You failed, as conservatives always do to offer a solution to the humanitarian crisis on our Southern Border.
For the most part the young refugees are fleeing the kind of failed society you lobby for here in the USA. Central America has been controlled by right wing puppet governments catering to the interest of a few extremely wealthy corporations, individuals and now drug cartels and gangs. Many of the central America gang leaders were trained at the US Army School of the America’s in brutality.
Larry,
Please watch this on using immigration as a scapegoat.
http://youtu.be/bJX5XHnONTI
Lonnie,
I’ll let somebody else argue with you.Go back to watching your communists websites.
Larry,
Having to deal with facts,reality and issues of public policy makes debating a bit more of a chore. I’ve enjoyed your attempt and you have touched on most of the myths and misinformation to be found on the right. Thank you for participating.